Curse

i Valinor · Jan 09, 2008, 06:49 AM // 06:49

i have been running Rapid fire with broadhead to shut down casters. i tend to switch between a long bow and hornbow when doing this and was woundered if RtW would be the better skill to run.

R A C · Jan 09, 2008, 06:59 AM // 06:59

Well, rtw makes the individual arrows fly faster, so you could use a flatbow, which is fast firing itself, if you wanted to stay far away. If distance isn't an issue, shortbow with rapid fire would fire the most arrows out of any combo, and utilize dazed the most. Throw in a IAS stance as well for insane speed. Of course, if the party is focused on the dazed target, your own rate of fire hardly matters with all the other hits.

edit: using rapid fire and an IAS stance goes well over the IAS cap, the IAS stance is nearly wasted as it hardly increases much after rapid fire. I tested this on the master of damage. dps went up substantially with just one on, but the second didn't add much.

Grammar · Jan 09, 2008, 07:22 AM // 07:22

If you plan on interrupting, you NEED either a recurve bow or Read the Wind (but not both).

Recurve bows are basically bows with RtW already built into them, so you're free to use other preps while remaining a strong interrupter.
But if you're using long and horn bows as you describe, than RtW is a must if you plan on doing any serious interrupting outside of Broad Head Arrow (which doesn't benefit from RtW btw) because their arrows are just too damn slow.

I've always been a big RtW fan, but lately I've found myself growing quite fond of Rapid Fire. Rapid Fire out-damages RtW by a fair amount, and you can still interrupt things granted you're using a recurve bow.
The only thing I hate about Rapid Fire is that damn hidden after-cast (about a second or so).

Amy Awien · Jan 09, 2008, 08:45 AM // 08:45

A dazed caster is interrupted when he gets hit, so with BHA you'd want to fire as many arrows as possible, a flatbow or shortbow with an IAS, like Rapid Fire, will interrupt more frequent.
RtW decreases arrow flighttime and is more suitable for directed interrupts like Distracting Shot and Savage Shot.

As for damage, Read the Wind is probably better against hard targets, the bonus damage ignores armor. Besides, you can use IAS stances even with RtW.

Shayne Hawke · Jan 09, 2008, 12:21 PM // 12:21

Nobody's mentioned it so far, so I guess I will.

I run Read The Wind and a Flatbow and use BHA to take down casters. But, Read The Wind doesn't seem to decrease the large arc from BHA, nor does it make it move faster.

I don't have experience using it with Rapid Fire though, so I can't help you there.

Aris the Accurate · Jan 09, 2008, 03:07 PM // 15:07

rapid fire is bad..if you absolutly NEED an ias to do your job your bad at ranger.

flatbow with ias still has a huge arc.

if your dazing something chances are that you arn't the only one hitting them..so attacking faster dosn't help much.

hornbow is not worth running..unless your doing r-spike, in other words used so very infrecuently its not worth having. Rtw is far superior to RF because rf only increases shots fired and dmg...not accuracy. Rangers have never been about dps, and they never will be.

In summary-
Quality not quanity

Yichi · Jan 09, 2008, 05:56 PM // 17:56

Ideally you want to use a shortbow for a BHA ranger.

Lhim · Jan 09, 2008, 06:28 PM // 18:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yichi

Ideally you want to use a shortbow for a BHA ranger.

Isn't BHA going to have the same arc and flight time no matter what bow you use? And only distance will affect it? So if you use a shortbow you'd hit quicker than with a flatbow, but if you were at the same distance with a flatbow, the arc and flight time would be the same.
I'm not sure about this though.

Sorry, a bit offtopic. But RtW doesn't affect BHA (seems to me), so I was wondering what does affect it.

System_Crush · Jan 09, 2008, 07:00 PM // 19:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by deank81

Sorry, a bit offtopic. But RtW doesn't affect BHA (seems to me), so I was wondering what does affect it.

This is true, note:
[skill=text]Read the Wind[/skill] reads: "Arrows move twice as fast" while;
[skill=text]Broad Head Arrow[/skill] reads: "Arrow, that moves slower than normal"

Conclusion:
BHA takes the 'normal' state, without any modifications and calculates it's speed from there, overwriting any other effects.

While RtW modifies the current speed, so technically it stacks with [skill=text]Favorable Winds[/skill] that also doesn't overwrite anything going from the skill descrip, though I'm unsure weather they actually max out somewhere...
Like, are they X*4 or X*(2*2)?

Quote:

Originally Posted by deank81

Isn't BHA going to have the same arc and flight time no matter what bow you use? And only distance will affect it? So if you use a shortbow you'd hit quicker than with a flatbow, but if you were at the same distance with a flatbow, the arc and flight time would be the same.
I'm not sure about this though.

At which point as it says in wiki,

Quote:

Originally Posted by gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Broad_Head_Arrow

The speed of the arrow (as influenced by the skill) cannot be increased with skills such as Favorable Winds and Read the Wind (though the speed and arc addition from the bow type using it can be lessened though negligible in comparison).

The 'normal' situation is based on which bow is used, by using a different bow you get a different BHA arch.

Grammar · Jan 09, 2008, 08:11 PM // 20:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shayne Hawke

Nobody's mentioned it so far, so I guess I will.

I mentioned it in the third post...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grammar

But if you're using long and horn bows as you describe, than RtW is a must if you plan on doing any serious interrupting outside of Broad Head Arrow (which doesn't benefit from RtW btw) because their arrows are just too damn slow.

(bolded for emphasis)
Why are we still talking about this? Everyone already knows that Broad Head Arrow is not effected by arrow speed buffs like RtW. Next topic please.

Fact: Rapid Fire out-damages RtW
Fact: If you still want to interrupt while using Rapid Fire, a recurve bow is a must

Fact: RtW increases your arrow speed and interrupt ability while still adding a decent amount of damage (10 per arrow)
Fact: With RtW, you can use any bow you want, and a recurve bow becomes ridiculously fast.

So the question here is, which set of facts is more appealing to you?
Oh, and keep in mind that annoying after-cast with Rapid Fire, because it will annoy and confuse (why the hell is it there?!) the crap out of you after while.

Wakka · Jan 09, 2008, 11:14 PM // 23:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aris the Accurate

rapid fire is bad..if you absolutly NEED an ias to do your job your bad at ranger.

flatbow with ias still has a huge arc.

if your dazing something chances are that you arn't the only one hitting them..so attacking faster dosn't help much.

hornbow is not worth running..unless your doing r-spike, in other words used so very infrecuently its not worth having. Rtw is far superior to RF because rf only increases shots fired and dmg...not accuracy. Rangers have never been about dps, and they never will be.

In summary-
Quality not quanity

*claps*

Cant agree more.

Quote:

Fact: With RtW, you can use any bow you want, and a recurve bow becomes ridiculously fast.

Actually using Read the Wind will allow a Flatbow's arrows to travel just as fast as a Recurve Bow's (Im assuming the Recurve Bow is also under the effects of RtW). The arrows from a Recurve move two times faster while a flatbow arrow speed is quadurpled. I hate flatbow's though.

makosi · Jan 09, 2008, 11:19 PM // 23:19

Can I be a black sheep and go for [skill]apply poison[/skill]?

It's much more threatening to cover your Dazed with another condition to make it that wee bit harder to get rid of.

In RA, having a pet and [skill]Heket's Rampage[/skill] also increases your number of hits although it reduces utility skills.

Shayne Hawke · Jan 09, 2008, 11:38 PM // 23:38

Usually what I have my heroes run is either a Water snare or MM, and I bring Pin Down for extra measure. That, and the fact that casters are usually casting cause me to worry a lot less about hitting with BHA.

I agree with above statements that a Hornbow is quite worthless. Grab something that gives you a shorter arc, or a faster refire rate if you have other interrupts.

RPGmaniac · Jan 09, 2008, 11:58 PM // 23:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by makosi

Can I be a black sheep and go for [skill]apply poison[/skill]?

It's much more threatening to cover your Dazed with another condition to make it that wee bit harder to get rid of.

That's what I do and I find it to be a lot more effective if you aren't on the monk. They need something like draw or RC to get rid of daze and if you see that, start going on the monk anyway.

I typically use BHA, Apply with a silencing recurve and lightning reflexes. I also have d-shot and savage in case I need to interrupt a signet or if auto attacking won't interrupt the next skill.

i Valinor · Jan 10, 2008, 06:43 AM // 06:43

thanks for the feedback. i havnt played a ranger in a long long time and had confused the hornbow stats with the recurve, but i remembered all the flight times and such is on wiki.

it is good to know that the dps from RF is higher then with RtW. i dint know if faster flight time and +dam worked out better then the 33%IAS.

i have only been running 3 bow attacks and the Rest BM. i jsut wanted to make sure i was getting a better result with RF then RtW.

thanks.

Amy Awien · Jan 10, 2008, 07:25 AM // 07:25

DPS from RF isn't (always) higher, RtW adds armor ignoring damage and will outperform RF against high AL opponents, like warriors.

distilledwill · Jan 10, 2008, 08:42 AM // 08:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by makosi

Can I be a black sheep and go for [skill]apply poison[/skill]?

It's much more threatening to cover your Dazed with another condition to make it that wee bit harder to get rid of.

This what I run, with a recurve bow its pretty much all you need. Although I wouldnt run Heket's rampage as if you are between bow shots and need to interupt a short cast time spell (whilst its only you on the target) its nice to pop out a [skill=text]Distracting Shot[/skill].

RPGmaniac · Jan 10, 2008, 08:46 AM // 08:46

One little bonus to apply that I just remembered is that you can also spam that on the entire opposing team, which can drain a monks energy if they decide to remove it on application.

distilledwill · Jan 10, 2008, 11:51 AM // 11:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by RPGmaniac

One little bonus to apply that I just remembered is that you can also spam that on the entire opposing team, which can drain a monks energy if they decide to remove it on application.

V true, Ive always thought that a ranger could probably complete most PvE campaigns using a build including only these:

[card]Distracting Shot[/card][card]Apply Poison[/card][card]Natural Stride[/card][card]Troll Unguent[/card]

tekDragon · Jan 10, 2008, 12:38 PM // 12:38

True enough... then a again with HnH you can probably compete most campaigns with a blank skill bar.